Balancing short-term wins with long-term growth is crucial in the fast-paced marketing world. In this interview, Coen sits down with Les Binet, Head of Effectiveness at adam&eveDDB, to discuss how brands can navigate this landscape. Les has profoundly influenced modern marketing strategies, primarily through his work on "The Long and the Short of It," co-authored with Peter Field.

Les Binet's Background and Role

Coen:
"Les, thanks for joining me. Could you tell us about your background and role at adam&eveDDB?"

Les Binet:
"Sure, Coen. I’ve been at adam&eveDDB for about 37 years, leading Effectiveness. My job revolves around helping advertisers measure how effective their marketing is, understanding what drives that effectiveness, and ultimately improving it. When I say 'effectiveness,' I talk about tangible business results—sales, revenue, profit—the hard numbers that matter.

Besides my day-to-day work, I’ve been lucky to dive into more academic research. I’ve collaborated with organizations like the IPA and worked closely with my colleague Peter Field. We’ve published several books, including 'The Long and the Short of It,' which explores the balance between short-term sales activation and long-term brand building."

Key Concepts in Advertising Effectiveness

Coen:
"Your work has significantly influenced how marketers think about advertising effectiveness. Could you summarize the main ideas from your research and how they’ve reshaped marketing strategies?"

Les Binet:
"Absolutely. At the heart of our research is the idea that advertising is a financial investment. You put money in, and you expect a return over time—sales, profit, cash flow. We’ve identified two main ways to invest in advertising.

First, there’s Sales Activation. This is about immediate tactics—direct response marketing, promotions, discounts. It’s efficient and can spike sales quickly, but the effects are short-lived.

Second, there’s Brand Building. This focuses on preparing people to buy in the future. It involves creating mental availability and emotional connections with a broader audience. It’s slower, and the short-term results might seem modest, but it leads to significant growth over time.

The key is balance. You need both. Short-term tactics don’t predict long-term success. Different strategies, media, and metrics are required for each, and they should work together."

Integrating Long-term Brand Building

Coen:
"Many marketers today seem heavily focused on short-term metrics like immediate sales. How can they better integrate long-term brand building into their strategies?"

Les Binet:
"That’s a common challenge, especially with the rise of digital marketing. The immediate data from clicks and conversions is tempting to chase. However, over-relying on short-term metrics can hurt long-term brand health.

To integrate long-term brand building, you need to invest in activities that might not yield immediate returns but build mental availability over time. That means using broad-reach media like TV, radio, and even some digital platforms to reach a broad audience.

Take Coca-Cola, for example. Even though they’re a household name, they continue to invest heavily in brand advertising. They understand that to stay top-of-mind, they need consistent, long-term efforts.

Also, focus on creating emotionally engaging content. Emotionally driven campaigns are more memorable and can build stronger brand associations. It’s about connecting with people on a deeper level."

The Importance of Mental Availability

Coen:
"You’ve emphasized the importance of mental availability over simple brand awareness. Could you explain why that distinction matters and how marketers can enhance mental availability in today’s crowded digital landscape?"

Les Binet:
"Sure. Brand awareness is knowing a brand exists. Mental availability is about how easily a brand comes to mind in buying situations. It’s the strength and number of memory structures linked to the brand.

Take Starbucks. People don’t just know Starbucks sells coffee. They associate it with a comfortable place to relax, meet friends, or do some work. These associations make Starbucks more likely to come to mind in various situations, not just when someone wants coffee.

To enhance mental availability, focus on creating strong, distinctive brand assets—logos, colors, jingles—that are consistently used across all touchpoints. Build associations with different usage occasions.

In the crowded digital space, it’s about cutting through the noise with emotionally engaging and memorable content. Consistency is key. If you keep changing your message or look, it’s harder for people to remember you."

Advertising as a 'Weak Force'

Coen:
"You’re known for challenging the idea that advertising is a strong force that directly causes sales. Can you elaborate on why it’s more of a ‘weak force’ and what that means for marketers?"

Les Binet:
"Yes, this concept comes from Andrew Ehrenberg’s work. The idea is that advertising isn’t about persuading people to make big changes. It’s not about converting a loyal Pepsi drinker into a Coca-Cola fan overnight.

Instead, advertising acts as a weak force. It nudges people slightly, increasing the probability they’ll choose your brand over another. These small shifts add up over time and across many people, leading to significant gains.

For marketers, this means focusing on consistency and patience. You won’t see dramatic changes overnight, but steady, consistent advertising can yield substantial results over the long term. It’s like compound interest—the effects build up over time."

Avoiding Surface-level Metrics

Coen:
"In an age where data is abundant, many marketers rely heavily on metrics that don’t necessarily correlate with long-term success. How can they avoid the trap of focusing on surface-level data?"

Les Binet:
"That’s a big issue. The immediacy of digital metrics—clicks, likes, shares—can give a false sense of effectiveness. While these metrics aren’t useless, they often don’t correlate with long-term growth or profitability.

You must balance short-term performance indicators with long-term metrics that reflect brand health—like mental availability, emotional engagement, and customer perceptions. Remember, some of the most impactful aspects of advertising—like emotional resonance—are more challenging to measure but crucial for long-term success.

Also, there needs to be more proper training in our industry. In fields like finance or medicine, rigorous training is mandatory. In marketing, that’s often different. This gap leads to over-reliance on easily accessible metrics, even if they’re not the most meaningful."

Balancing Targeted and Broad-Reach Advertising

Coen:
"With connected TV and digital platforms offering more volume and targeted advertising, how should marketers approach these channels while maintaining broad reach and brand-building principles?"

Les Binet:
"Connected TV and digital platforms have their place, but we need to use them wisely. The temptation is to hyper-target, thinking we’re being efficient. However, over-targeting can limit your reach, which is detrimental to brand building.

Brand building requires reaching as many potential buyers as possible. So, use these platforms to extend your reach, not narrow it. For instance, using connected TV to broadcast emotionally engaging ads to a broad audience.

Also, be cautious about turning the TV into a direct selling mechanism. People watch TV to relax, not to be bombarded with calls to action. If we try to make every ad a direct response, we risk annoying viewers and damaging the brand."

Concerns About Digital-First Focus Among Young Marketers

Coen:
"You’ve expressed concerns about the new generation of marketers focusing primarily on digital direct response. Could you expand on that?"

Les Binet:
"Yes, it’s a concern. Many young marketers have grown up in the digital era, where digital direct response tactics dominate. They’ve been trained to focus on immediate metrics—clicks, conversions—without understanding the long-term effects of branding.

This focus can lead to neglecting brand-building fundamentals. It risks creating campaigns that might drive short-term sales but don’t build lasting brand equity. Worse, it can annoy consumers with overly aggressive tactics.

We need to ensure that marketers receive proper training. Just as you wouldn’t want an untrained surgeon operating on you, we should only have marketers making decisions with a solid foundation in marketing principles. It’s about understanding both the art and science of marketing."

Perspectives on Marketing Theory Debates

Coen:
"There’s often talk about differences between leading figures in marketing like yourself, Byron Sharp, and Mark Ritson. How do you view these disagreements?"

Les Binet:
"Honestly, we agree on much more than we disagree. Journalists often focus on our differences because it makes for a better story, but that’s not the whole picture.

Byron Sharp’s (Ehrenberg-Bass) work on mental and physical availability aligns closely with our findings on brand building. Mark Ritson emphasizes the importance of proper market understanding and strategic balance. Any disagreements are usually about nuances, not fundamental principles.

Healthy debate is valuable—it pushes the industry forward. But it’s important to recognize that our core ideas about effective marketing are widely shared. Focusing on our common ground helps advance the field more than highlighting disagreements."

Key Takeaways and Recommended Reads for Marketers

Coen:
"Given everything we’ve discussed, what are the important books to read and key lessons for marketers regarding effective advertising?"

Les Binet:
In terms of books:”If you can only read one book, Start with Byron Sharps “How Brands Grow” and if you can read two, maybe “The Long and Short of it” (smiles)

As for the key lesson, focus on understanding the balance between short-term sales activation and long-term brand building. Don’t get so caught up in immediate metrics that you lose sight of long-term growth.

Invest in emotionally engaging, creative advertising that builds mental availability. Focus on consistency and reach. And don’t underestimate the power of emotion—it makes your brand more memorable and likable.

Also, prioritize proper training. Marketing is complex and requires a solid understanding of psychology, economics, and data analysis. We need to ensure that marketers are equipped with the proper knowledge.

By focusing on these areas, you can create campaigns that deliver both short-term results and contribute to sustainable, long-term success.”